Where did it all go wrong?

[Nige]

Let's be honest, something has gone horribly wrong.

This is definitely not the same team that made the 8 last year (forget finals and what happened vs Carlton).

Something's missing, something's gotten to the boys... because we're coming up short on too many occasions.

There's definitely a bit of emphasis on Dimma, but we can't sack him because that's just only gonna make things worse and prove to be another setback.

So then we have the players. Clearly some need to be dropped and given a reality check. Names like Vickery, Grigg and Chaplin spring to mind. There are a few who are performing well, but we need more than a few and we need the rest to be as consistent.

2-6 after 8 rounds is not where we should be, so where did it all go wrong?

[Vinny]

Even though I love to see the Tigers suffer, I don't think Hardwick should be sacked. That'd be stupid, the pressure will be on for sure but sacking him isn't going to help right now.

There is only so much a coach can do, if the players don't kick straight and apply scoreboard pressure, that's on them, not the coach.

[JBs-Hawks]

If you jump on GC then you cant refer to Richmond as 'we' ;)

[Vinny]

If you jump on GC then you cant refer to Richmond as 'we' ;)

Yeah this too.

[nrich102]

I wouldn't mind Brisbane having 2 wins at the moment :'(

Just whatever Richmond choose to do, make sure Lennon gets games and scores well ;) Really need him in BXVs :P

[Nige]

If you jump on GC then you cant refer to Richmond as 'we' ;)

Yeah this too.

Easy to kick a man while he's down hey?

Was quite clearly a rash, heat-of-the-moment thing that happened, firmly sticking with my Tiges.  :)

[Bill Manspeaker]

not good enough Nige. I think you should publicly apologize and say you were wrong to leave your team behind.

only playin with you man. but still think you should say you were wrong to turn your back on the Tiges, even it was only for a brief moment

:P

[DazBurg]

look on the bright side Nige

if your not first your last 9th :P

sorry sorry that was uncalled for

still love ya nige  :P

[quinny88]

It's certainly been a hard fall from grace but there are reasons behind it. They aren't acceptable ones and not excuses but I put it down to 3 things.
1. Different personnel than last years side
2. Playing the wrong players
3. Injuries/ players out of form.

It is a drastically different side both on paper and on form and confidence.

This is the team that played in the elimination final last year. The bold players are the ones that didn't play on the weekend.

B: Steven Morris Alex Rance Dylan Grimes

HB: Ricky Petterd Troy Chaplin Chris Newman

C: Shaun Grigg Trent Cotchin Daniel Jackson

HF: Nick Vlastuin Aaron Edwards Jake King

F: Dustin Martin Jack Riewoldt Ty Vickery

Fol: Ivan Maric Brett Deledio Shane Edwards

I/C: Brandon Ellis Bachar Houli Reece Conca

B: Shane Tuck

In those guys place we had:
Lennon (1 game)
Lloyd (5 games)
Griffiths (25 games)
McDonough (6 games)
Astbury (37 games)
Hampson (70 games)
Foley (138 games)
So it's a far more inexperienced side on the park at the moment.

That along with terrible form, particularly from:
1. Chaplin who was our General down back last year and was rarely beaten.
2. Vickery who is as about as useful to us this year as he was when he was 18 years old.
3. Grigg who is a ball magnet that gets away with things when we are winning but they show up ten times worse when we're not.

None of these 3 should be in the team which is what I meant about the wrong players being played. Grigg seams to be an automatic selection for some stupid reason.

Mix with that some injuries to key players on our list. Missing Jackson, Rance, King, Lids and Ivan for a large chunk of the season has hurt us. They are all structurally so important and all leaders in their position.

Every team has injuries so that's no excuse. The blokes that are there needed to lift and really the only person I could say that is clearly having a better season this year than last year is Astbury and now he looks set to miss a large chunk of the season  ::)
Cotchin and Martin do their best but the guys like Conca, Ellis, Shane Edwards etc needed to stand up and go to the next level and they just haven't for whatever reason. Bad form and lack of confidence is contagious and it's running through the team like a disease at the moment.
We need a spark to get us going. I don't mind the idea of us playing the kids. Miles is a jet and will be elevated shortly. The opportunity needs to be given to these types and push the guys out like Grigg, Foley etc who are just making up the numbers. Play them in the VFL. If they are dominating and knocking the door down in the VFL then give them a senior game. Don't just persist with guys that aren't part of our future.

I want to see our side look something like this in the back half of the year:

B: Morris, Rance, Grimes
Hb: Houli, Chaplin, Vlastuin
C: Jackson, Cotchin, Ellis
Hf: Martin, Griffiths, Conca
F: Lloyd, Riewoldt, Lennon

Foll: Maric, Deledio, Miles
Int: McBean, Knights, McDonough sub: S.edwards

Chappy only there because Astbury is injured..
Newman, King are the only 2 that I would bring in after they are ready.

Guys like Petterd, Grigg, Vickery should be absolutely tearing it apart in the 2's to get a chance back in the senior side.

This team would probably get belted a lot but at least we will expose these guys to see what they have to offer rather than just playing the same out of form blokes every week that don't deserve to be in the team and aren't part of our future.

The leaders and second tier players of that 22 need to be leaders and do it by example, just as Geelong do. So easy for kids to transition into Afl when the leaders of your club stand up and show the way.
But more importantly the 2nd level of players need to lift and show the way.

[kilbluff1985]

Miles 8)

i traded him into my AF side tonight as i'm expecting/hoping he will play this week 8)

[nickstiges]

Newman and King are not best 22 they weren't before they were injured and I don't think hey are if/when they are fit, need to look to players like Dea, Batchelor, Helbig, O'Hanlon, Gordon & Arnot to show some of their potential in the seniors. Also I don't think McBean is ready for seniors yet his body just isn't big enough, Elton is probably closer.

Grigg has to be dropped he provides nothing to the team that any VFL player could do sufficiently on the wing playing purely uncontested football (I mean just look at his tackle numbers).

Looking to next week Miles must be promoted and selected & Grimes or Batchelor to replace Astbury depending on Grimes' fitness. Knights and Maric can't come back fast enough.

[quinny88]

Newman and King are not best 22 they weren't before they were injured and I don't think hey are if/when they are fit, need to look to players like Dea, Batchelor, Helbig, O'Hanlon, Gordon & Arnot to show some of their potential in the seniors. Also I don't think McBean is ready for seniors yet his body just isn't big enough, Elton is probably closer.

Grigg has to be dropped he provides nothing to the team that any VFL player could do sufficiently on the wing playing purely uncontested football (I mean just look at his tackle numbers).

Looking to next week Miles must be promoted and selected & Grimes or Batchelor to replace Astbury depending on Grimes' fitness. Knights and Maric can't come back fast enough.

Newman is the sole veteran of our club and gives 100% every game. Let him play out the year out of respect.
King is definitely best 22. Hardwick has said on numerous occasions that he's the barometer of our club and he's right. When king is playing well, Richmond are playing well. He had something like 8 operations in the off season and never looked right at the start of the year. His game is based on tackles and pressure and he does that better than anyone when fit. Need him back in the forward line.

Miles won't be elevated until after round 12 or whenever it is that every club gets an upgrade. If we upgrade him now then he can only play until king is taken off the LTI list.

[Nige]

I'm not sure King's going to go around another season, and the same goes for Newy. They're great contributors when they're in form and do play, but as you said earlier quinny, we might as well blood the kids to take over their roles. That's not to say we don't play either of them again this year, but manage them both and play them when we need the experience most.



I'd personally like to see the team with everyone fit and in form look like: (I'll probably forget somebody)

B: Steven Morris Alex Rance Dylan Grimes

HB: Troy Chaplin David Astbury Nick Vlastuin

C: Trent Cotchin Daniel Jackson Anthony Miles

HF: Chris Knights Ben Griffiths Ben Lennon

F: Dustin Martin Jack Riewoldt Nathan Gordon

Fol: Ivan Maric Brett Deledio Shane Edwards

I/C: Brandon Ellis Bachar Houli Reece Conca Sub: Matt McDonough

Guys who are unlucky but should push for places: Newy, King, Arnot, Grigg, Dea, McBean, Petterd, Hampson

[Kellogscrunchynut]

The thing is last year a lot of our less talented players were playing well, winning premierships is about the bottom 6 players on the ground playing better than the oppositions bottoms 6.

[Rusty00]

The thing is last year a lot of our less talented players were playing well, winning premierships is about the bottom 6 players on the ground playing better than the oppositions bottoms 6.

This is the key point, a number of Tigers had career best years last year and/or played above themselves and this year they have either plateaud or gone backwards.

It is/was a similar situation to the Crows 2012-13 and the Hawks 2008-09 which results in a major drop down the ladder.

Richmond also don't have the depth that they can afford to have players like Maric and Deledio on the sidelines.