Was chatting with some Kings fans in the US and one of them made a very good point that I thought could be a good discussion point. This has been centered around the discussion that Doncic is not considered athletic enough to play in the NBA.
List of players listed as not athletic enough (pre draft)
Jayson Tatum - 2017
Devin Booker - 2015
D'Angelo Russell - 2015
Dario Saric - 2014
Doug McDermott - 2014
Gary Harris - 2014
CJ McCollum - 2013
Otto Porter - 2013
Trey Burke - 2013
Klay Thompson - 2011
Jimmer Fredette - 2011
Evan Turner - 2010
Gordon Hayward - 2010
James Harden - 2009
Stephen Curry - 2009
Ricky Rubio - 2009
Danilo Gallinari - 2008
List of players considered to have a high athleticism (pre draft)
Jonathan Issac - 2017
Frank Ntilikina - 2017
Kris Dunn - 2016 - 2016
Marquese Chriss - 2016
Emmanuel Mudiay - 2015
Justice Winslow - 2015
Andrew Wiggins - 2014
Aaron Grodon - 2014
Elfrid Payton - 2014
Nerlens Noel - 2013
Ben McLemore - 2013
Thomas Robinson - 2012
My time of the year where I care about NBA then I can go back to focusing on college ball. Will post something similar to last year which players will have instant impact who has the biggest potential.
A few names I really like are Kyhri Thomas (3 and D guy) terrific defender, can defend from PG to SF and can crate his own offence. Will be mid to late first round. Another one is Tony Carr other than the NBA is filled with small guards who can shoot Carr is one of the best in the class. Doesn’t have the added agility, playmaking and defensive skills that some in the draft have but this guys a pure shot market.
I have always been a fan of the pure basketball player eg Tatum over Jackson I was a massive fan of because of the instant impact. The proplem with the players that are “athletic†is either they were just athletes or missing something from their game. Not too many just athletic guys who can’t do much else in this draft. However the names you provided below is a reason why I rated Markkanan, Dillon Brooks, Josh Hart etc much higher than where they were picked up
Very interesting in the back end of the draft now. The depth is gone, the Frank Jackson, Tony Bradley types aren’t there and most people picked in the second round would be ready to make an instant impact being 22 rather than 19. However the senior class was much better than last year which could see only a few play minutes and the rest are back to the Gleague. NBA missed out big time with guys like Tyus Battle, Lindell Wiggington that’s only about 2 of 10-15 players being nearly as good as the seniors but with more time to grow and have bigger potentials decided to return to college. Weak draft in 2019 these guys will go first round next year but would have been handy for teams to grab this year. Good for the players, bad NBA.
Obviously there is Ayton, Doncic, Bagley at the top, with Bamba, Jackson jr, MPJ, Carter and the guards(Knox, SGA, Young, Sexton, Bridges) could go anywhere from 4-12. The next few are floaters and it really is only 3 or 4 then we could see the next 20 or so picks could be in any order. None of those are safe first round picks reason why so much talent returned to make sure of the first round money in 2019
@Valk - how will you feel when Sacramento pass on the best 18 year old basketball player since LeBron to take a 6'11 guy who can't shoot or play defense?
Quote from: Jay on June 20, 2018, 07:17:55 PM
@Valk - how will you feel when Sacramento pass on the best 18 year old basketball player since LeBron to take a 6'11 guy who can't shoot or play defense?
I'm not quite sure why Doncic is dropping apart from the fact that cos he's still playing Euro season that he hasn't been able to work out for any teams - but surely his playing in the Euroleagues should be sufficient for teams to work out what he can do??
I get why Kings are interested in Bagley, Phoenix might have gone for him if we were picking lower as the proverbial 'hindsight' best player in the draft 5-10yrs down the track … but as per Valk's post above, most of the 'non-athletics' can shoot and the NBA is a shooters league (finally) now … :D
Bagley apparently did well in the combine (that right?) as well as team workouts ...
Surely Phoenix can't f*ck this draft up this time … but given Suns' poor luck draft-wise generally speaking, I'm just praying like mad that Ayton isn't the next Oden … that would be worst case and best case, Embiid-lite w/out the injuries ... ;)
As a Suns fan, i'm still ok with Jackson over Taytum cos we need a potential two-way lockdown wing defender … Taytum was always going to be more polished than Jackson initially, but again we needed the potential D and the thought was that Jackson's still got more development in him, whereas Taytum is where he's at, which is obviously still quality, but do you take a Ray Allen type or Kawhi Leonard type, is how I'd see it ...
1. Ayton to Suns
2. Bagley Jnr to Kings
3. Doncic to Hawks, but traded to Mavs
4. Jackson Jnr to Griz
5. Young to Mavs, but traded to Hawks
6. Bamba to Magic
7. Carter Jnr to Bulls
8. Sexton to Cavs
9. Knox to Knicks
10. Mikal Bridges to 76ers
11. Gilgeous-Alexander to Hornets, but traded to Clips
12. Miles Bridges to Clips, but traded to Hornets
Should have taken Porter. Although his medicals must be a mess for him to keep falling.
And we have had another two picks go by and Porter is still on the board. Something has to be seriously wrong for no one to have taken a punt on him so far.
Interesting that the Kings take Bagley
So now we have all of these players in the front court.
WCS
Skal
Giles
Bagley
Koufos
Z-Bo
Jakar Sampson
Someone will have to be moved on
Denver finally take Porter...a lot of scoring on that team! :o
Unbelievable how did Walker last until Spurs
Big Question: Does anyone draft LaVar LiAngelo Ball
All that Mikal Bridges talk and hes gone in an hour aha
LiAngelo? someone will take him for the laughs surely
This Robert Williams kid still not taken, meant to be in the mould of Capela they say, but sounds like he rubbed everyone the wrong way with his attitude.
Quote from: Hawka on June 22, 2018, 12:53:13 PM
All that Mikal Bridges talk and hes gone in an hour aha
LiAngelo? someone will take him for the laughs surely
makes no sense to me, you pick the perfect ready 3 and D player to help you push for the ECF crown and then you trade it for a raw guy and a later pick.
to me Suns should have taken the raw upside kid and the Sixers should have taken the older 3 and D guy
Quote from: Holz on June 22, 2018, 01:14:34 PM
makes no sense to me, you pick the perfect ready 3 and D player to help you push for the ECF crown and then you trade it for a raw guy and a later pick.
to me Suns should have taken the raw upside kid and the Sixers should have taken the older 3 and D guy
Saved them a mill and the Miaimi pick looks to be an asset down the road (unprotected). The cash gives them more room to possibly sign a max contract player (aka LeBron). Fits the strategy well actually and Smith reminds Brown of Leonard
Williams to Boston, steal of the draft?
Quote from: Holz on June 22, 2018, 01:14:34 PM
Quote from: Hawka on June 22, 2018, 12:53:13 PM
All that Mikal Bridges talk and hes gone in an hour aha
LiAngelo? someone will take him for the laughs surely
makes no sense to me, you pick the perfect ready 3 and D player to help you push for the ECF crown and then you trade it for a raw guy and a later pick.
to me Suns should have taken the raw upside kid and the Sixers should have taken the older 3 and D guy
This.
Wtf are Phily doing? Smith isn’t in the same ball park at Bridges
What did they get at the back end Phily?
Quote from: jvalles69 on June 22, 2018, 01:19:33 PM
Williams to Boston, steal of the draft?
Potentially. His game more suited to College, thought he would slide but probably not this far
Quote from: R.Griffen on June 22, 2018, 01:20:10 PM
What did they get at the back end Phily?
I think it was a 2020 1st round pick as well
Quote from: Mat0369 on June 22, 2018, 01:18:53 PM
Quote from: Holz on June 22, 2018, 01:14:34 PM
makes no sense to me, you pick the perfect ready 3 and D player to help you push for the ECF crown and then you trade it for a raw guy and a later pick.
to me Suns should have taken the raw upside kid and the Sixers should have taken the older 3 and D guy
Saved them a mill and the Miaimi pick looks to be an asset down the road (unprotected). The cash gives them more room to possibly sign a max contract player (aka LeBron). Fits the strategy well actually and Smith reminds Brown of Leonard
yes i understand it but if they pick up Lebron then they are in win now mode and id rather have Bridges on the squad.
I hope your right on Leonard Smith comparison
i just really liked Bridges and thought he was the perfect fit for the team
So when I saw Thomas go to Phily I thought they had done good by the Bridges decision. Only to trade him on... Horrible night for Phily imo
At time of writing only 1 bloke now there that should have probably been picked up. How is Keita Bates-Diop still there
2021 is the year the one and done rule will likely be abolished. So you're going to have guys going right from high school that year making it the deepest in a long time.
With the limited roster space these moves are Hinkie-esque gathering assets. With the limited roster spots the second round picks this year are either going to be stashes or they were going to trade them for later picks. Makes perfect sense. One of the Detroit seconds is going to be a 2021 pick to go along with the Heat unprotected first rounder.
Quote from: Holz on June 22, 2018, 01:26:42 PM
yes i understand it but if they pick up Lebron then they are in win now mode and id rather have Bridges on the squad.
I hope your right on Leonard Smith comparison
i just really liked Bridges and thought he was the perfect fit for the team
Bridges is supposed to be a RoCo 2.0. Smith is the most athletic player in this draft and was someone they were considering at 10 if Bridges was gone. When the Suns come calling with what they offered you make that deal. It's not even a question. This team is not competing next year anyway without a star. They need as much cap room as possible and assets if they need to trade for someone. They also believe Smith is a high upside guy so it works.
Quote from: Mat0369 on June 22, 2018, 02:32:49 PM
2021 is the year the one and done rule will likely be abolished. So you're going to have guys going right from high school that year making it the deepest in a long time.
With the limited roster space these moves are Hinkie-esque gathering assets. With the limited roster spots the second round picks this year are either going to be stashes or they were going to trade them for later picks. Makes perfect sense. One of the Detroit seconds is going to be a 2021 pick to go along with the Heat unprotected first rounder.
For sure, along with the 2020 draft too as a dominate second and third year college players will be trying to get a contract before the 2021 draft
ok im liking it more,
just need to get PG Lebron or Kawhi there.
im a philly fan already by the way
Quote from: jvalles69 on June 22, 2018, 01:19:33 PM
Williams to Boston, steal of the draft?
Love this pick. But the steal of the draft is clearly Doncic.
Quote from: Jay on June 22, 2018, 05:31:46 PM
Quote from: jvalles69 on June 22, 2018, 01:19:33 PM
Williams to Boston, steal of the draft?
Love this pick. But the steal of the draft is clearly Doncic.
Agree everyone who passes on Doncic is going to regret it, but Williams at 27 to none other than Boston of all teams wins it for me if he's good especially in the short term with the position Boston are in.
Quote from: Jay on June 22, 2018, 05:31:46 PM
Quote from: jvalles69 on June 22, 2018, 01:19:33 PM
Williams to Boston, steal of the draft?
Love this pick. But the steal of the draft is clearly Doncic. Keita Bates-Diop
Quote from: Mat0369 on June 22, 2018, 02:41:06 PM
Quote from: Holz on June 22, 2018, 01:26:42 PM
yes i understand it but if they pick up Lebron then they are in win now mode and id rather have Bridges on the squad.
I hope your right on Leonard Smith comparison
i just really liked Bridges and thought he was the perfect fit for the team
Bridges is supposed to be a RoCo 2.0. Smith is the most athletic player in this draft and was someone they were considering at 10 if Bridges was gone. When the Suns come calling with what they offered you make that deal. It's not even a question. This team is not competing next year anyway without a star. They need as much cap room as possible and assets if they need to trade for someone. They also believe Smith is a high upside guy so it works.
Yeah, that's what i was wondering why would they take a similar player type that they already have - Phoenix are just looking for young talent that will help them compete now, but develop with the young core and they are crying out for 3 & D, so that makes sense to me as a Suns fan. Z Smith is your D Mitchell-type hope which I can understand from a Philly perspective to put beside Fultz, Simmons, Embiid and 'super' Dario ... win-win imo ...
as a fan i'm pretty ok with Ayton, Mikal & Okobo ...
Reckon Philly might package Fultz and send him off.
Brown is building a warchest for a superstar. I'm thinking it's Leonard but he has made it known he won't sign an extension anywhere other than LA.
On Fultz, Drew Hanlen had some good stuff to say about Fultz on a podcast
"Most documented case of the YIPs of basketball where he completely forgot how to shoot. For him, it was how can I get him back rolling to where he was before if not better. Says they are way ahead of pace where he thought they’d be.
his shot isn’t perfect yet, but it will be by the end of the summer and he’ll be back rolling and show people why he was the top pick. He told Fultz you’re going to make me really famous when I fix your shot and get you back rolling.â€
So is everyone happy with their teams draft hauls??
Free agency period going to astound or be just meh??
Don't think LeBron will go on TV this time ('The Decision') … ?? ;)
Looks like DJ will finally end up a Mav after the the lock down debacle last time! Liking the look of the Mavs, pity about the superteams. DJ, Doncic, Barnes, Matthews, Smith Jnr with Dirk coming off the bench.
Quote from: jvalles69 on June 30, 2018, 11:16:22 PM
Looks like DJ will finally end up a Mav after the the lock down debacle last time! Liking the look of the Mavs, pity about the superteams. DJ, Doncic, Barnes, Matthews, Smith Jnr with Dirk coming off the bench.
Yeah, don't sound bad at all...
Do you know roughly how much per year jv?
Valk, happy with Marvin Bagley III?
Quote from: j959 on July 01, 2018, 06:32:33 PM
Quote from: jvalles69 on June 30, 2018, 11:16:22 PM
Looks like DJ will finally end up a Mav after the the lock down debacle last time! Liking the look of the Mavs, pity about the superteams. DJ, Doncic, Barnes, Matthews, Smith Jnr with Dirk coming off the bench.
Yeah, don't sound bad at all...
Do you know roughly how much per year jv?
Valk, happy with Marvin Bagley III?
Not sure, don't think the deal is finalised, but should be a lock.
Locking this thread now. Chat in new NBA thread for all free agency and season talk